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  • "Over the course of 1,700 years, the Eldians would designate all other races of the world as inferior and resort to genocide and rape in order to cleanse the world of other peoples"

    Okay, this is one of the worst things I have read about Eldians. Of course, Paradis is mentioned to be a mixed race of Eldians and Marlayans, but, I hope Eren and Co realise that the power of Titans had made Eldians arrogant, inhuman, perverse and completely monstrous - more so than Titans and now current Marlayans. I mean systemic violence and oppression of other races don't make Eldians a pretty nice bunch either. 

    I think the best thing would be if in some way the people of Paradis can be a beacon that Eldians and Marlayens can live together. After all, many other races do live in Paradis and Mikasa Ackerman is a representation of that. But the Eldians also have persecuted the Asian lineage. One of the problematic elements of this manga is that Mikasa seems well, unhinged, by the devastation of her people. And Eren seems completely unhinged by the past acts of Eldians on other races. This is a reductionism of what it means to be human. Like I know Mikasa really loves her family and all but I think it was important that Mikasa also feel some resentment towards the government for hurting her people. Similarly, Eren should understand that his own people had unjustly done horrible things. 

    Things should change and not be all about all-out war again. It just feels kinda simplistic and cuts down the complexity of the series to do so. 

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    • Yah that 1700 year cleansing never happened

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    • Junior0124 wrote:
      Yah that 1700 year cleansing never happened

      Are you telling me it didn't happen? Well, I am not sure it completely didn't. Maybe, Ymir Fritz didn't do any damage but I am sure the nine titans did. They completely conquered Marley. No, seriously, was it just propaganda? because it is cited as something that did happen. And, no, I don't agree with Grisha Jaegar at all. Nor do I agree with Marleyan government mistreating Eldians. Nor do I agree with how Paradis treated its Asiatic citizens. They were persecuted and exiled. The socio-politics of Paradis are as bad as Marley. The Reiss family were okay if Eldians from Marley had hurt their citizens as long they can keep the coordinate. That is also oppression. 

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    • NephilimGear wrote:

      Junior0124 wrote:
      Yah that 1700 year cleansing never happened

      Are you telling me it didn't happen? Well, I am not sure it completely didn't. Maybe, Ymir Fritz didn't do any damage but I am sure the nine titans did. They completely conquered Marley. No, seriously, was it just propaganda? because it is cited as something that did happen. And, no, I don't agree with Grisha Jaegar at all. Nor do I agree with Marleyan government mistreating Eldians. Nor do I agree with how Paradis treated its Asiatic citizens. They were persecuted and exiled. The socio-politics of Paradis are as bad as Marley. The Reiss family were okay if Eldians from Marley had hurt their citizens as long they can keep the coordinate. That is also oppression. 

      To be honest, maybe you are right. There may have been some sort of ethnic cleansing which explains the lack of diverse races e.g. Asians etc. But during the conversation between Grisha and Kruger, Kruger states that if there really was a 1700 year period of ethnic cleansing then Marleyans would not exist - they would have been wiped out also. This implies that cleansing never really happened especially now that the Middle East are gearing up for war means that there are still more races out there.

      Given the power of the Eldians, Ymir's Titans could easily have wiped out all other races in less than 100 years let alone 1700. In fact they wouldn't have needed to lift a finger. The fact that the Wall King said that if the Marleyans disturbed his Paradise then he would release the millions of wall Titans and lay waste to the world. This shows just a glimpse of the power of Ymir's people and Ymir herself could probably accomplish even more.

      One thing I am curious about is the real truth of the Titans, because during that conversation Kruger discredits everything that had been discovered thus far. As Owl, he sent false historical documents to the Eldian Restorationists to boost their morale as when Grisha confronts these facts, Kruger simply says that in this world there is no such thing as the truth, anyone can make up a story and claim it as the truth. It seems that the nine Titans are real but how did Ymir actually obtain Titans power. I'm not sure but the story of Ymir's soul being split into the nine Titans and her receiving the power of the Titans from a devil may have been one of the false historical documents which makes it even more confusing.

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    • Junior0124 wrote:

      NephilimGear wrote:

      Junior0124 wrote:
      Yah that 1700 year cleansing never happened
      Are you telling me it didn't happen? Well, I am not sure it completely didn't. Maybe, Ymir Fritz didn't do any damage but I am sure the nine titans did. They completely conquered Marley. No, seriously, was it just propaganda? because it is cited as something that did happen. And, no, I don't agree with Grisha Jaegar at all. Nor do I agree with Marleyan government mistreating Eldians. Nor do I agree with how Paradis treated its Asiatic citizens. They were persecuted and exiled. The socio-politics of Paradis are as bad as Marley. The Reiss family were okay if Eldians from Marley had hurt their citizens as long they can keep the coordinate. That is also oppression. 

      To be honest, maybe you are right. There may have been some sort of ethnic cleansing which explains the lack of diverse races e.g. Asians etc. But during the conversation between Grisha and Kruger, Kruger states that if there really was a 1700 year period of ethnic cleansing then Marleyans would not exist - they would have been wiped out also. This implies that cleansing never really happened especially now that the Middle East are gearing up for war means that there are still more races out there.

      Given the power of the Eldians, Ymir's Titans could easily have wiped out all other races in less than 100 years let alone 1700. In fact they wouldn't have needed to lift a finger. The fact that the Wall King said that if the Marleyans disturbed his Paradise then he would release the millions of wall Titans and lay waste to the world. This shows just a glimpse of the power of Ymir's people and Ymir herself could probably accomplish even more.

      One thing I am curious about is the real truth of the Titans, because during that conversation Kruger discredits everything that had been discovered thus far. As Owl, he sent false historical documents to the Eldian Restorationists to boost their morale as when Grisha confronts these facts, Kruger simply says that in this world there is no such thing as the truth, anyone can make up a story and claim it as the truth. It seems that the nine Titans are real but how did Ymir actually obtain Titans power. I'm not sure but the story of Ymir's soul being split into the nine Titans and her receiving the power of the Titans from a devil may have been one of the false historical documents which makes it even more confusing.

      the truth hasn't been revealed, so we can say anything to relate to the current situation.

      Marley could possibly be a violent and greedy race who always want to disturb society. if this is true, then it means that the Devil, Titan genocide on marley and the other inferiors are false things. 

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    • Junior0124
      Junior0124 removed this reply because:
      Mistake
      11:13, April 3, 2017
      This reply has been removed
    • Junior0124 wrote:

      NephilimGear wrote:

      Junior0124 wrote:
      Yah that 1700 year cleansing never happened
      Are you telling me it didn't happen? Well, I am not sure it completely didn't. Maybe, Ymir Fritz didn't do any damage but I am sure the nine titans did. They completely conquered Marley. No, seriously, was it just propaganda? because it is cited as something that did happen. And, no, I don't agree with Grisha Jaegar at all. Nor do I agree with Marleyan government mistreating Eldians. Nor do I agree with how Paradis treated its Asiatic citizens. They were persecuted and exiled. The socio-politics of Paradis are as bad as Marley. The Reiss family were okay if Eldians from Marley had hurt their citizens as long they can keep the coordinate. That is also oppression. 

      To be honest, maybe you are right. There may have been some sort of ethnic cleansing which explains the lack of diverse races e.g. Asians etc. But during the conversation between Grisha and Kruger, Kruger states that if there really was a 1700 year period of ethnic cleansing then Marleyans would not exist - they would have been wiped out also. This implies that cleansing never really happened especially now that the Middle East are gearing up for war means that there are still more races out there.

      Given the power of the Eldians, Ymir's Titans could easily have wiped out all other races in less than 100 years let alone 1700. In fact they wouldn't have needed to lift a finger. The fact that the Wall King said that if the Marleyans disturbed his Paradise then he would release the millions of wall Titans and lay waste to the world. This shows just a glimpse of the power of Ymir's people and Ymir herself could probably accomplish even more.

      One thing I am curious about is the real truth of the Titans, because during that conversation Kruger discredits everything that had been discovered thus far. As Owl, he sent false historical documents to the Eldian Restorationists to boost their morale as when Grisha confronts these facts, Kruger simply says that in this world there is no such thing as the truth, anyone can make up a story and claim it as the truth. It seems that the nine Titans are real but how did Ymir actually obtain Titans power. I'm not sure but the story of Ymir's soul being split into the nine Titans and her receiving the power of the Titans from a devil may have been one of the false historical documents which makes it even more confusing.

      I think the genocide of other races could easily have skipped over some Marley races. I think it can be partly true. What is incontrovertible is that Elidans did take away much of Marley land and all as conquerers. If they divvied up everything perhaps the Marleyans would not have been so angry and do all that they did. Also, as we know that Titans are well, cheap killing machines used by Eldians think of how Marleyans were devoured so that Eldians can win their conquest. Ethnic cleansing does not always ensure wipe out entirely but reduce numbers. In 1700 years Marley population may have grown again after that. But yes, I don't agree when Grisha Jaegar said what his ancestors did was right. Nor, do I agree with the Marleyan government. I am not at all happy with Paradis either.

      You know one good thing about another anime like "Full Metal Alchemist" is that it actually tackled these controversial elements. We don't exactly know what the "unseen paths" are that allow people with Eldian blood to transform to titans but uptil now they are the only race (I think some Marleyans can) who can turn into Titans. The flesh and bone coming from somewhere. Ha Ha Philospher's stone (FMA joke). 

      Yes, what or who did Ymir Fritz make this pact with. This source of organic material. Was it a demon? Will Eren have to fight this demon last? I am curious. 

      Mid East Allied forces are actually good guys it seems. I actually am curious about all of this. Yes, it great AOT is going outside the walls. But, I actually also liked that so-called leaked information that Titans were made a guy to wipe out humanity. This new lore is also kinda interesting. And, I actually once did imagine Titans as construction workers and all of that. I hope this isn't some Marley vs Eldian story because then it will become anachronistic and boring. 

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    • NephilimGear wrote:

      Junior0124 wrote:

      NephilimGear wrote:

      Junior0124 wrote:
      Yah that 1700 year cleansing never happened
      Are you telling me it didn't happen? Well, I am not sure it completely didn't. Maybe, Ymir Fritz didn't do any damage but I am sure the nine titans did. They completely conquered Marley. No, seriously, was it just propaganda? because it is cited as something that did happen. And, no, I don't agree with Grisha Jaegar at all. Nor do I agree with Marleyan government mistreating Eldians. Nor do I agree with how Paradis treated its Asiatic citizens. They were persecuted and exiled. The socio-politics of Paradis are as bad as Marley. The Reiss family were okay if Eldians from Marley had hurt their citizens as long they can keep the coordinate. That is also oppression. 

      To be honest, maybe you are right. There may have been some sort of ethnic cleansing which explains the lack of diverse races e.g. Asians etc. But during the conversation between Grisha and Kruger, Kruger states that if there really was a 1700 year period of ethnic cleansing then Marleyans would not exist - they would have been wiped out also. This implies that cleansing never really happened especially now that the Middle East are gearing up for war means that there are still more races out there.

      Given the power of the Eldians, Ymir's Titans could easily have wiped out all other races in less than 100 years let alone 1700. In fact they wouldn't have needed to lift a finger. The fact that the Wall King said that if the Marleyans disturbed his Paradise then he would release the millions of wall Titans and lay waste to the world. This shows just a glimpse of the power of Ymir's people and Ymir herself could probably accomplish even more.

      One thing I am curious about is the real truth of the Titans, because during that conversation Kruger discredits everything that had been discovered thus far. As Owl, he sent false historical documents to the Eldian Restorationists to boost their morale as when Grisha confronts these facts, Kruger simply says that in this world there is no such thing as the truth, anyone can make up a story and claim it as the truth. It seems that the nine Titans are real but how did Ymir actually obtain Titans power. I'm not sure but the story of Ymir's soul being split into the nine Titans and her receiving the power of the Titans from a devil may have been one of the false historical documents which makes it even more confusing.

      I think the genocide of other races could easily have skipped over some Marley races. I think it can be partly true. What is incontrovertible is that Elidans did take away much of Marley land and all as conquerers. If they divvied up everything perhaps the Marleyans would not have been so angry and do all that they did. Also, as we know that Titans are well, cheap killing machines used by Eldians think of how Marleyans were devoured so that Eldians can win their conquest. Ethnic cleansing does not always ensure wipe out entirely but reduce numbers. In 1700 years Marley population may have grown again after that. But yes, I don't agree when Grisha Jaegar said what his ancestors did was right. Nor, do I agree with the Marleyan government. I am not at all happy with Paradis either.

      You know one good thing about another anime like "Full Metal Alchemist" is that it actually tackled these controversial elements. We don't exactly know what the "unseen paths" are that allow people with Eldian blood to transform to titans but uptil now they are the only race (I think some Marleyans can) who can turn into Titans. The flesh and bone coming from somewhere. Ha Ha Philospher's stone (FMA joke). 

      Yes, what or who did Ymir Fritz make this pact with. This source of organic material. Was it a demon? Will Eren have to fight this demon last? I am curious. 

      Mid East Allied forces are actually good guys it seems. I actually am curious about all of this. Yes, it great AOT is going outside the walls. But, I actually also liked that so-called leaked information that Titans were made a guy to wipe out humanity. This new lore is also kinda interesting. And, I actually once did imagine Titans as construction workers and all of that. I hope this isn't some Marley vs Eldian story because then it will become anachronistic and boring. 

      It's very true that the 1700 year ethnic cleansing may not have been 100% successful. The Titan War proved this as the Eldians eventually lost. I'm not entirely sure whether Grisha said that what his ancestors did were right but it may have been because of the false historical documents that Kruger (aka Owl) sent the Eldian Restorationists and well a sense of patriotism. In the face of the oppression him and his country men were receiving it's not surprising that Grisha would believe in what his ancestors had done as he would feel nothing but hatred to the kind who killed his sister.

      Im not sure if it's the "unseen paths" that allow Eldians to become Titans, I just think it's how they are due to Ymir's pact with the "devil". It's kind of like Ymir's curse of dying 13 years after becoming a Titan shifter. The "unseen paths" connect Eldians to the Founder Titan and allows for the supernatural transferal of Shifter abilities. While Eren was reciting from a dream about his father to Armin, Eren says that even if a Titan shifter dies without being consumed by another Titan, there powers will automatically reside within a newborn Eldian baby probably due to the "unseen paths" that connect them. The manga states that only Eldians can turn into Titans, maybe half Marleyans and half Eldians can still do it. And yeah the flesh and bone thing is so weird like how is that even possible maybe it's from the source of organic material that Titan bodies are created and hardening is possible.

      We know nothing really about the Mid East Allied Forces except that they have the technology to take down even one of the 9 Titans with a single missile. They may be good or evil who knows but I think they are just fighting against the Marleyans quest for imperialism. The people from Paradis may have to fight alongside them.

      Haha, I even thought for a minute myself that maybe some guy in a laboratory created Titans as weapons or something.

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    • I wonder if only eldians can into Titans. I wonder if other races can and it is not just not taken into exposition yet. 

      I just want some form of peace, democracy or diplomacy to return to all the continents of their world. I think the one way to do this is to destroy the Titans or create a new lineage of Titans. Paradis has obviously hurt the people of Asian lineage thus it is still pretty unrealistic that Mikasa does not give a shit about it.

      And, you could be right. Grisha has been manipulated too. In fact, Zeke's hate for his father is because his father was apparently abusive towards him with all these ideologies. I cannot say Zeke himself is not brainwashed by Marleyans. What happened to Zeke is documented by the movie "Swing Kids" which is about NAzi Youth and how easily they were brainwashed or even how kindness worked. When Zeke did not find kindness in his life with his family he found it with his Marleyan educators. 

      yes, I didn't know abourt new baby titan hehehe but yeah Eren is the first of his kind to be both founding Titan and Attack Titan. This means that maybe Titan are also evolving. Who knows maybe the person to inherit other Titan form may be Mikasa or someone from her maternal people. It would actually be cool if other races can become Titans. On another note, Eren should take the socio-political history of both Eldia and Marley into account before making any decisions. The fact is he should use his powers to heal the world and not make a new regime all over again. 

      Also, it was never verified what happened to Fay. I have a feeling she is alive. 

      It is interesting the new season of anime has started. 

      In the end of the show I hope Eren is able to find closure and that he actually realises, as he did already, that Titans were not his enemy. Rather it was human greed that drove Titans. If the Great Titan War did not happen and if he the King did not remove himself to Paradis this would not have happened. 

      I wouldn't like the show to be a Us vs Them thing because it would be too silly. I would actually like good Marleyans and also horrible Eldians who know what's up but actually support Marley like I don't know King Reiss himself is one of them. I mean the royal family is responsible for all the problems in Paradis. They are okay with normal humans dying out as long as they can control Titans and Titan shifters. Think about it. When Wall Maria was breached they could have stopped the horde of Titans in Shinganshina District but did not and ultimately caused fatalities. More so than Marleyans they themselves were also responsible. This is the sort of crap that greed can accomplish. And, Eren should recognise this. 

      He should also show compassion for people like Annie and Reiner who had been blackmailed and subjugated all their lives to do Marley's biddings. They were never given an identity beyond this. If Eren fails to show comapssion and even understanding of people in this chaotic world he is working as badly as Eldian and Marley governments :/ That would be bad. 

      Yes, Marley's quest for imperialism should stop but not by making former mistakes. This cycle of hatred and death should be finally culled because it has taken so many lives and deformed so many people into Titans that clearly it is wrong. If you think about it the concept of Titan itself is a curse. Only Titan shifters can be said to have powers  but regular Titans lose everything and become nothing but oversized zombies. And Eldian rulers did use this practice to make cheap labour and also make armies but LITERALLY stripping away the humanity of their own people. This is also something that can't be ignored. There are some complicated plot points in AOT which is good but I hope the mangaka fleshes them out nor else this series will definitely fall flat on its face. 

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    • My personal theory is that Ymir Fritz accidentaly connected with the Primogenital titan, who then used Ymir as a host and proceded to connect itself with the Eldian population using Ymir's DNA as model

      However Ymir's body couldn't hold it for more then 13 years so the Progenital titan ended up splitting itself in nine parts to other hosts due to its power being too great to transfer this way as whole and caused the Progenital itself to lose control over its host.

      Due to using Ymir's DNA, most of its power passed to Ymir's relatives and could only be fully used by them.

      The fact Ymir split herself in nine is actually pure congecture, all Eldians are infected but only nine at a time are able use it rationaly.

      In short the Progenital Titan is a parassite being that lives trough those of Eldian blood, the Titans are a manifestation of its sickness triggered by consuming a Titan's spine fluid.

      Uniting all Shifters in one could be an horrible idea as then the Progenitor Titan would be whole again, aware of its host weakness and might try to take over the world to assure its existence.

      Who can our heroes cure themselvers? simple find the Primogenital titan's source and destroy it, currently it's projecting itself to the coordinate and can only be found with the coordinate as a guide.

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    • CommonSwift wrote:
      My personal theory is that Ymir Fritz accidentaly connected with the Primogenital titan, who then used Ymir as a host and proceded to connect itself with the Eldian population using Ymir's DNA as model

      However Ymir's body couldn't hold it for more then 13 years so the Progenital titan ended up splitting itself in nine parts to other hosts due to its power being too great to transfer this way as whole and caused the Progenital itself to lose control over its host.

      Due to using Ymir's DNA, most of its power passed to Ymir's relatives and could only be fully used by them.

      The fact Ymir split herself in nine is actually pure congecture, all Eldians are infected but only nine at a time are able use it rationaly.

      In short the Progenital Titan is a parassite being that lives trough those of Eldian blood, the Titans are a manifestation of its sickness triggered by consuming a Titan's spine fluid.

      Uniting all Shifters in one could be an horrible idea as then the Progenitor Titan would be whole again, aware of its host weakness and might try to take over the world to assure its existence.

      Who can our heroes cure themselvers? simple find the Primogenital titan's source and destroy it, currently it's projecting itself to the coordinate and can only be found with the coordinate as a guide.

      This is an interesting theory and makes very good sense and I wouldn't be surprised if this happens in the end buddy. Yeah, they have either excise the coordinate, put it on someone else or kill Eren =( The Origin Titan is like the Thing from that classic horror movie if you think about it how it transmits itself through blood and all that. Killing the Origin Titan may stop the reign of Titans but it would be a blessing for the Earth Eren and Co. live in.

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    • NephilimGear wrote: I wonder if only eldians can into Titans. I wonder if other races can and it is not just not taken into exposition yet. 

      I just want some form of peace, democracy or diplomacy to return to all the continents of their world. I think the one way to do this is to destroy the Titans or create a new lineage of Titans. Paradis has obviously hurt the people of Asian lineage thus it is still pretty unrealistic that Mikasa does not give a shit about it.

      And, you could be right. Grisha has been manipulated too. In fact, Zeke's hate for his father is because his father was apparently abusive towards him with all these ideologies. I cannot say Zeke himself is not brainwashed by Marleyans. What happened to Zeke is documented by the movie "Swing Kids" which is about NAzi Youth and how easily they were brainwashed or even how kindness worked. When Zeke did not find kindness in his life with his family he found it with his Marleyan educators. 

      yes, I didn't know abourt new baby titan hehehe but yeah Eren is the first of his kind to be both founding Titan and Attack Titan. This means that maybe Titan are also evolving. Who knows maybe the person to inherit other Titan form may be Mikasa or someone from her maternal people. It would actually be cool if other races can become Titans. On another note, Eren should take the socio-political history of both Eldia and Marley into account before making any decisions. The fact is he should use his powers to heal the world and not make a new regime all over again. 

      Also, it was never verified what happened to Fay. I have a feeling she is alive. 

      It is interesting the new season of anime has started. 

      In the end of the show I hope Eren is able to find closure and that he actually realises, as he did already, that Titans were not his enemy. Rather it was human greed that drove Titans. If the Great Titan War did not happen and if he the King did not remove himself to Paradis this would not have happened. 

      I wouldn't like the show to be a Us vs Them thing because it would be too silly. I would actually like good Marleyans and also horrible Eldians who know what's up but actually support Marley like I don't know King Reiss himself is one of them. I mean the royal family is responsible for all the problems in Paradis. They are okay with normal humans dying out as long as they can control Titans and Titan shifters. Think about it. When Wall Maria was breached they could have stopped the horde of Titans in Shinganshina District but did not and ultimately caused fatalities. More so than Marleyans they themselves were also responsible. This is the sort of crap that greed can accomplish. And, Eren should recognise this. 

      He should also show compassion for people like Annie and Reiner who had been blackmailed and subjugated all their lives to do Marley's biddings. They were never given an identity beyond this. If Eren fails to show comapssion and even understanding of people in this chaotic world he is working as badly as Eldian and Marley governments :/ That would be bad. 

      Yes, Marley's quest for imperialism should stop but not by making former mistakes. This cycle of hatred and death should be finally culled because it has taken so many lives and deformed so many people into Titans that clearly it is wrong. If you think about it the concept of Titan itself is a curse. Only Titan shifters can be said to have powers  but regular Titans lose everything and become nothing but oversized zombies. And Eldian rulers did use this practice to make cheap labour and also make armies but LITERALLY stripping away the humanity of their own people. This is also something that can't be ignored. There are some complicated plot points in AOT which is good but I hope the mangaka fleshes them out nor else this series will definitely fall flat on its face. 

      I seriously don't think anyone else but Ymir's people can turn into Titans but who knows maybe the serum will work on other races.

      Everyone wants peace lol but there are always different levels to that - Marleyan peace may be different from Eldian peace. And sorry to say this but Titans will never truly be extinguished it's impossible. Like I said earlier, Titan shifters don't have to be consumed in order for their abilities to be absorbed; it'll always find its way to another Eldian after their death through the unseen paths connecting them. A new lineage of Titans sounds reasonable but the 13 year expiry date is a bit scary because as soon as you become a Titan shifter you only have 13 years to live. Imagine being a newborn Eldian baby and dying at 13 for no reason it's so sad as you can't choose your fate. With Mikasa, I don't think it's a case of whether she cares or not but actually whether she is aware of the genocide that wiped out her race. Her parents may never have told her about that.

      But still man, Zeke was a disappointment like how could he do that. Ok yeah it was Grisha's fault but damn man, I don't think I'd sentence my dad to death just for forcefully trying to impose his ideologies on me. Even so there was no sense of loyalty with Zeke I mean no matter what that was his father and mother who got killed because of him. And he didn't even seem remorseful. I think Kruger says that Zeke got brainwashed by the Marleyans.

      I doubt Titans are evolving they are just doing what they have always been capable of - Titans can absorb powers by consuming other Titans. It was just proved by Grisha that any Titan can absorb another's power and add it to their own. The Progenitor Titan was eaten by Attack Titan Grisha and so the Attack Titan now has the Founder Titans power - the coordinate. Mikasa is already badass she doesn't need a Titan form she's the female Levi. Yes Eren should do the righteous thing but you know how he is, hot headed and emotional he probably bares hatred towards the Marleyans. At the end of chapter 90, Eren says that their enemies are beyond the wall and only true freedom will be accomplished if they kill them. So yeah Erens gonna go in guns blazing with no room for small talk.

      Yes it was, Grisha says in the manga that her body was found by a river after being severly bitten by dogs.

      You made me think for a second, I never thought like that. It is true the King could have saved lives by using the coordinate to drive away the Titans, but remember the Reiss family are under the Kings ideology and so believe in a world ruled by Titans so you can see why they didn't interfere.

      And yeah at first I bore nothing but hatred and anger at Reiner, Bertholdt and Annie. I couldn't understand why they would betray humanity like that but if you've read chapter 91 you'd understand. The Eldians that are in Marley have been brainwashed with false propaganda and I believe this is what happened to Zeke. They are brought up with false historical documents claiming that the Eldians in Paradis are spawns of the devil and need to be exterminated in order for the good Eldians who are in internment zones (basically ghettos like the underground district in Paradise) to be released from their poverty but it's obvious they are just being used to do their dirty work. It's so sickening to think that Eldians are killing themselves off. One half of the race against the other all because of the Marleyans.

      Absolutely, Marley are becoming too greedy way beyond control and it needs to stop. No one is perfect in this world but it seems things may have to go to choosing the lesser evil in the end. Think back to how many Survey Corps members died even civilians and innocents. Not only Eren, everyone from Paradis won't forget this and will surely wage war against Marley it seems inevitable.

      The Mid East Allied Forces may be troublesome in the future, the fact that they have developed weapons capable of taking down one of the 9 Titans in a single strike is frightening, they can't be trusted. This may really be what Hange said it was - Paradis vs the rest of the world. That would be an epic finale to the show but the world itself would be too damaged, what would the world look like in the end.

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    • CommonSwift wrote: My personal theory is that Ymir Fritz accidentaly connected with the Primogenital titan, who then used Ymir as a host and proceded to connect itself with the Eldian population using Ymir's DNA as model

      However Ymir's body couldn't hold it for more then 13 years so the Progenital titan ended up splitting itself in nine parts to other hosts due to its power being too great to transfer this way as whole and caused the Progenital itself to lose control over its host.

      Due to using Ymir's DNA, most of its power passed to Ymir's relatives and could only be fully used by them.

      The fact Ymir split herself in nine is actually pure congecture, all Eldians are infected but only nine at a time are able use it rationaly.

      In short the Progenital Titan is a parassite being that lives trough those of Eldian blood, the Titans are a manifestation of its sickness triggered by consuming a Titan's spine fluid.

      Uniting all Shifters in one could be an horrible idea as then the Progenitor Titan would be whole again, aware of its host weakness and might try to take over the world to assure its existence.

      Who can our heroes cure themselvers? simple find the Primogenital titan's source and destroy it, currently it's projecting itself to the coordinate and can only be found with the coordinate as a guide.

      Wow that's really something. But the Progenitor Titan can't be destroyed, it will simply pass its ability to another Eldian and continue its cycle.

        Loading editor
    • Junior0124 wrote:

      NephilimGear wrote: I wonder if only eldians can into Titans. I wonder if other races can and it is not just not taken into exposition yet. 

      I just want some form of peace, democracy or diplomacy to return to all the continents of their world. I think the one way to do this is to destroy the Titans or create a new lineage of Titans. Paradis has obviously hurt the people of Asian lineage thus it is still pretty unrealistic that Mikasa does not give a shit about it.

      And, you could be right. Grisha has been manipulated too. In fact, Zeke's hate for his father is because his father was apparently abusive towards him with all these ideologies. I cannot say Zeke himself is not brainwashed by Marleyans. What happened to Zeke is documented by the movie "Swing Kids" which is about NAzi Youth and how easily they were brainwashed or even how kindness worked. When Zeke did not find kindness in his life with his family he found it with his Marleyan educators. 

      yes, I didn't know abourt new baby titan hehehe but yeah Eren is the first of his kind to be both founding Titan and Attack Titan. This means that maybe Titan are also evolving. Who knows maybe the person to inherit other Titan form may be Mikasa or someone from her maternal people. It would actually be cool if other races can become Titans. On another note, Eren should take the socio-political history of both Eldia and Marley into account before making any decisions. The fact is he should use his powers to heal the world and not make a new regime all over again. 

      Also, it was never verified what happened to Fay. I have a feeling she is alive. 

      It is interesting the new season of anime has started. 

      In the end of the show I hope Eren is able to find closure and that he actually realises, as he did already, that Titans were not his enemy. Rather it was human greed that drove Titans. If the Great Titan War did not happen and if he the King did not remove himself to Paradis this would not have happened. 

      I wouldn't like the show to be a Us vs Them thing because it would be too silly. I would actually like good Marleyans and also horrible Eldians who know what's up but actually support Marley like I don't know King Reiss himself is one of them. I mean the royal family is responsible for all the problems in Paradis. They are okay with normal humans dying out as long as they can control Titans and Titan shifters. Think about it. When Wall Maria was breached they could have stopped the horde of Titans in Shinganshina District but did not and ultimately caused fatalities. More so than Marleyans they themselves were also responsible. This is the sort of crap that greed can accomplish. And, Eren should recognise this. 

      He should also show compassion for people like Annie and Reiner who had been blackmailed and subjugated all their lives to do Marley's biddings. They were never given an identity beyond this. If Eren fails to show comapssion and even understanding of people in this chaotic world he is working as badly as Eldian and Marley governments :/ That would be bad. 

      Yes, Marley's quest for imperialism should stop but not by making former mistakes. This cycle of hatred and death should be finally culled because it has taken so many lives and deformed so many people into Titans that clearly it is wrong. If you think about it the concept of Titan itself is a curse. Only Titan shifters can be said to have powers  but regular Titans lose everything and become nothing but oversized zombies. And Eldian rulers did use this practice to make cheap labour and also make armies but LITERALLY stripping away the humanity of their own people. This is also something that can't be ignored. There are some complicated plot points in AOT which is good but I hope the mangaka fleshes them out nor else this series will definitely fall flat on its face. 

      I seriously don't think anyone else but Ymir's people can turn into Titans but who knows maybe the serum will work on other races.

      Everyone wants peace lol but there are always different levels to that - Marleyan peace may be different from Eldian peace. And sorry to say this but Titans will never truly be extinguished it's impossible. Like I said earlier, Titan shifters don't have to be consumed in order for their abilities to be absorbed; it'll always find its way to another Eldian after their death through the unseen paths connecting them. A new lineage of Titans sounds reasonable but the 13 year expiry date is a bit scary because as soon as you become a Titan shifter you only have 13 years to live. Imagine being a newborn Eldian baby and dying at 13 for no reason it's so sad as you can't choose your fate. With Mikasa, I don't think it's a case of whether she cares or not but actually whether she is aware of the genocide that wiped out her race. Her parents may never have told her about that.

      But still man, Zeke was a disappointment like how could he do that. Ok yeah it was Grisha's fault but damn man, I don't think I'd sentence my dad to death just for forcefully trying to impose his ideologies on me. Even so there was no sense of loyalty with Zeke I mean no matter what that was his father and mother who got killed because of him. And he didn't even seem remorseful. I think Kruger says that Zeke got brainwashed by the Marleyans.

      I doubt Titans are evolving they are just doing what they have always been capable of - Titans can absorb powers by consuming other Titans. It was just proved by Grisha that any Titan can absorb another's power and add it to their own. The Progenitor Titan was eaten by Attack Titan Grisha and so the Attack Titan now has the Founder Titans power - the coordinate. Mikasa is already badass she doesn't need a Titan form she's the female Levi. Yes Eren should do the righteous thing but you know how he is, hot headed and emotional he probably bares hatred towards the Marleyans. At the end of chapter 90, Eren says that their enemies are beyond the wall and only true freedom will be accomplished if they kill them. So yeah Erens gonna go in guns blazing with no room for small talk.

      Yes it was, Grisha says in the manga that her body was found by a river after being severly bitten by dogs.

      You made me think for a second, I never thought like that. It is true the King could have saved lives by using the coordinate to drive away the Titans, but remember the Reiss family are under the Kings ideology and so believe in a world ruled by Titans so you can see why they didn't interfere.

      And yeah at first I bore nothing but hatred and anger at Reiner, Bertholdt and Annie. I couldn't understand why they would betray humanity like that but if you've read chapter 91 you'd understand. The Eldians that are in Marley have been brainwashed with false propaganda and I believe this is what happened to Zeke. They are brought up with false historical documents claiming that the Eldians in Paradis are spawns of the devil and need to be exterminated in order for the good Eldians who are in internment zones (basically ghettos like the underground district in Paradise) to be released from their poverty but it's obvious they are just being used to do their dirty work. It's so sickening to think that Eldians are killing themselves off. One half of the race against the other all because of the Marleyans.

      Absolutely, Marley are becoming too greedy way beyond control and it needs to stop. No one is perfect in this world but it seems things may have to go to choosing the lesser evil in the end. Think back to how many Survey Corps members died even civilians and innocents. Not only Eren, everyone from Paradis won't forget this and will surely wage war against Marley it seems inevitable.

      The Mid East Allied Forces may be troublesome in the future, the fact that they have developed weapons capable of taking down one of the 9 Titans in a single strike is frightening, they can't be trusted. This may really be what Hange said it was - Paradis vs the rest of the world. That would be an epic finale to the show but the world itself would be too damaged, what would the world look like in the end.

      We think the Founding Titan can't be destroyed but there might be a way. Maybe, something that we haven't thought of yet that is there. Even if the Titan shifting thing is born in a baby it still can be erased. After all there were once a time when humans were hust humans. 

      Yes, obviously, Paradis has to defend itself or rather some people of Paradis. But it shouldn't do what Marleyans are doing or what Eldians did so many years ago. Eren is hot tempered and emotional but he may eventually mature in the series as Ed Elric did in FMA. 

      I do believe Titans are evolving because from 9 now its 8. But yes the Royal family of Paradis are as bad as well Marleyan government now.

      The Mid East Allied forces are against Marley and The Edlian Restorationists did ask them for help once. So, they have weapons to destroy Titans there is nothing wrong with that. They also need to protect themselves because Titans can kill so many and devour so many. They should be allies because it would be kinda silly to fight everyone and just gain supremacy for Paradis again. That would be a stupid ass neo imperialism and it would do no one any favours. 

      I think I understand Zeke. Yes, what he did was wrong. But he was abused by Grisha and Dina. What his parents did was wrong. That poor guy was like only 5 or 7 and they kept on hounding at him to be a double agent. Do you know how wrong that is? Yes, he should not have turned his parents in and made that happen but his parents also should not have used him as a pawn. In fact, Grisha did it again with Eren. Yes, it helped Eren but at what cost? He has the curse of Ymir now too and he would never be able to live out his life outside that unless he detroys the coordinate in himself. That is pretty sad. 

      I do want Eren and Paradis to be one with the rest of the world. Even if Marleyan peace and Eldian peace is different there can be negotiations and both sides can shoulder their own burdens and each other. Making one epic finale battle will be nice to watch but also pretty much ruin the hell out of the world. People should coexist. lack of coexistence is one of the reasons even the real world is in so much problem.

      It would be great if the continents can live in harmony again and Eren and everyone gains peace. It would be actually awesome if Eren lives in Marley at the end of the series =) and tries to learn more about other countries and all that and works with Zeke. It would be nice. And actually great. 

        Loading editor
    • NephilimGear wrote:
      Junior0124 wrote:

      NephilimGear wrote: I wonder if only eldians can into Titans. I wonder if other races can and it is not just not taken into exposition yet. 

      I just want some form of peace, democracy or diplomacy to return to all the continents of their world. I think the one way to do this is to destroy the Titans or create a new lineage of Titans. Paradis has obviously hurt the people of Asian lineage thus it is still pretty unrealistic that Mikasa does not give a shit about it.

      And, you could be right. Grisha has been manipulated too. In fact, Zeke's hate for his father is because his father was apparently abusive towards him with all these ideologies. I cannot say Zeke himself is not brainwashed by Marleyans. What happened to Zeke is documented by the movie "Swing Kids" which is about NAzi Youth and how easily they were brainwashed or even how kindness worked. When Zeke did not find kindness in his life with his family he found it with his Marleyan educators. 

      yes, I didn't know abourt new baby titan hehehe but yeah Eren is the first of his kind to be both founding Titan and Attack Titan. This means that maybe Titan are also evolving. Who knows maybe the person to inherit other Titan form may be Mikasa or someone from her maternal people. It would actually be cool if other races can become Titans. On another note, Eren should take the socio-political history of both Eldia and Marley into account before making any decisions. The fact is he should use his powers to heal the world and not make a new regime all over again. 

      Also, it was never verified what happened to Fay. I have a feeling she is alive. 

      It is interesting the new season of anime has started. 

      In the end of the show I hope Eren is able to find closure and that he actually realises, as he did already, that Titans were not his enemy. Rather it was human greed that drove Titans. If the Great Titan War did not happen and if he the King did not remove himself to Paradis this would not have happened. 

      I wouldn't like the show to be a Us vs Them thing because it would be too silly. I would actually like good Marleyans and also horrible Eldians who know what's up but actually support Marley like I don't know King Reiss himself is one of them. I mean the royal family is responsible for all the problems in Paradis. They are okay with normal humans dying out as long as they can control Titans and Titan shifters. Think about it. When Wall Maria was breached they could have stopped the horde of Titans in Shinganshina District but did not and ultimately caused fatalities. More so than Marleyans they themselves were also responsible. This is the sort of crap that greed can accomplish. And, Eren should recognise this. 

      He should also show compassion for people like Annie and Reiner who had been blackmailed and subjugated all their lives to do Marley's biddings. They were never given an identity beyond this. If Eren fails to show comapssion and even understanding of people in this chaotic world he is working as badly as Eldian and Marley governments :/ That would be bad. 

      Yes, Marley's quest for imperialism should stop but not by making former mistakes. This cycle of hatred and death should be finally culled because it has taken so many lives and deformed so many people into Titans that clearly it is wrong. If you think about it the concept of Titan itself is a curse. Only Titan shifters can be said to have powers  but regular Titans lose everything and become nothing but oversized zombies. And Eldian rulers did use this practice to make cheap labour and also make armies but LITERALLY stripping away the humanity of their own people. This is also something that can't be ignored. There are some complicated plot points in AOT which is good but I hope the mangaka fleshes them out nor else this series will definitely fall flat on its face. 

      I seriously don't think anyone else but Ymir's people can turn into Titans but who knows maybe the serum will work on other races.

      Everyone wants peace lol but there are always different levels to that - Marleyan peace may be different from Eldian peace. And sorry to say this but Titans will never truly be extinguished it's impossible. Like I said earlier, Titan shifters don't have to be consumed in order for their abilities to be absorbed; it'll always find its way to another Eldian after their death through the unseen paths connecting them. A new lineage of Titans sounds reasonable but the 13 year expiry date is a bit scary because as soon as you become a Titan shifter you only have 13 years to live. Imagine being a newborn Eldian baby and dying at 13 for no reason it's so sad as you can't choose your fate. With Mikasa, I don't think it's a case of whether she cares or not but actually whether she is aware of the genocide that wiped out her race. Her parents may never have told her about that.

      But still man, Zeke was a disappointment like how could he do that. Ok yeah it was Grisha's fault but damn man, I don't think I'd sentence my dad to death just for forcefully trying to impose his ideologies on me. Even so there was no sense of loyalty with Zeke I mean no matter what that was his father and mother who got killed because of him. And he didn't even seem remorseful. I think Kruger says that Zeke got brainwashed by the Marleyans.

      I doubt Titans are evolving they are just doing what they have always been capable of - Titans can absorb powers by consuming other Titans. It was just proved by Grisha that any Titan can absorb another's power and add it to their own. The Progenitor Titan was eaten by Attack Titan Grisha and so the Attack Titan now has the Founder Titans power - the coordinate. Mikasa is already badass she doesn't need a Titan form she's the female Levi. Yes Eren should do the righteous thing but you know how he is, hot headed and emotional he probably bares hatred towards the Marleyans. At the end of chapter 90, Eren says that their enemies are beyond the wall and only true freedom will be accomplished if they kill them. So yeah Erens gonna go in guns blazing with no room for small talk.

      Yes it was, Grisha says in the manga that her body was found by a river after being severly bitten by dogs.

      You made me think for a second, I never thought like that. It is true the King could have saved lives by using the coordinate to drive away the Titans, but remember the Reiss family are under the Kings ideology and so believe in a world ruled by Titans so you can see why they didn't interfere.

      And yeah at first I bore nothing but hatred and anger at Reiner, Bertholdt and Annie. I couldn't understand why they would betray humanity like that but if you've read chapter 91 you'd understand. The Eldians that are in Marley have been brainwashed with false propaganda and I believe this is what happened to Zeke. They are brought up with false historical documents claiming that the Eldians in Paradis are spawns of the devil and need to be exterminated in order for the good Eldians who are in internment zones (basically ghettos like the underground district in Paradise) to be released from their poverty but it's obvious they are just being used to do their dirty work. It's so sickening to think that Eldians are killing themselves off. One half of the race against the other all because of the Marleyans.

      Absolutely, Marley are becoming too greedy way beyond control and it needs to stop. No one is perfect in this world but it seems things may have to go to choosing the lesser evil in the end. Think back to how many Survey Corps members died even civilians and innocents. Not only Eren, everyone from Paradis won't forget this and will surely wage war against Marley it seems inevitable.

      The Mid East Allied Forces may be troublesome in the future, the fact that they have developed weapons capable of taking down one of the 9 Titans in a single strike is frightening, they can't be trusted. This may really be what Hange said it was - Paradis vs the rest of the world. That would be an epic finale to the show but the world itself would be too damaged, what would the world look like in the end.

      We think the Founding Titan can't be destroyed but there might be a way. Maybe, something that we haven't thought of yet that is there. Even if the Titan shifting thing is born in a baby it still can be erased. After all there were once a time when humans were hust humans. 

      Yes, obviously, Paradis has to defend itself or rather some people of Paradis. But it shouldn't do what Marleyans are doing or what Eldians did so many years ago. Eren is hot tempered and emotional but he may eventually mature in the series as Ed Elric did in FMA. 

      I do believe Titans are evolving because from 9 now its 8. But yes the Royal family of Paradis are as bad as well Marleyan government now.

      The Mid East Allied forces are against Marley and The Edlian Restorationists did ask them for help once. So, they have weapons to destroy Titans there is nothing wrong with that. They also need to protect themselves because Titans can kill so many and devour so many. They should be allies because it would be kinda silly to fight everyone and just gain supremacy for Paradis again. That would be a stupid ass neo imperialism and it would do no one any favours. 

      I think I understand Zeke. Yes, what he did was wrong. But he was abused by Grisha and Dina. What his parents did was wrong. That poor guy was like only 5 or 7 and they kept on hounding at him to be a double agent. Do you know how wrong that is? Yes, he should not have turned his parents in and made that happen but his parents also should not have used him as a pawn. In fact, Grisha did it again with Eren. Yes, it helped Eren but at what cost? He has the curse of Ymir now too and he would never be able to live out his life outside that unless he detroys the coordinate in himself. That is pretty sad. 

      I do want Eren and Paradis to be one with the rest of the world. Even if Marleyan peace and Eldian peace is different there can be negotiations and both sides can shoulder their own burdens and each other. Making one epic finale battle will be nice to watch but also pretty much ruin the hell out of the world. People should coexist. lack of coexistence is one of the reasons even the real world is in so much problem.

      It would be great if the continents can live in harmony again and Eren and everyone gains peace. It would be actually awesome if Eren lives in Marley at the end of the series =) and tries to learn more about other countries and all that and works with Zeke. It would be nice. And actually great. 

      greedy ass marley would never let peace exist. and if the mass genocide really happened(on marley), then they would never forgive.... SPOILER: see season 2 ending , it shows what may have happened during the nine titan's rule

        Loading editor
    • Arshpar wrote:
      NephilimGear wrote:
      Junior0124 wrote:

      NephilimGear wrote: I wonder if only eldians can into Titans. I wonder if other races can and it is not just not taken into exposition yet. 

      I just want some form of peace, democracy or diplomacy to return to all the continents of their world. I think the one way to do this is to destroy the Titans or create a new lineage of Titans. Paradis has obviously hurt the people of Asian lineage thus it is still pretty unrealistic that Mikasa does not give a shit about it.

      And, you could be right. Grisha has been manipulated too. In fact, Zeke's hate for his father is because his father was apparently abusive towards him with all these ideologies. I cannot say Zeke himself is not brainwashed by Marleyans. What happened to Zeke is documented by the movie "Swing Kids" which is about NAzi Youth and how easily they were brainwashed or even how kindness worked. When Zeke did not find kindness in his life with his family he found it with his Marleyan educators. 

      yes, I didn't know abourt new baby titan hehehe but yeah Eren is the first of his kind to be both founding Titan and Attack Titan. This means that maybe Titan are also evolving. Who knows maybe the person to inherit other Titan form may be Mikasa or someone from her maternal people. It would actually be cool if other races can become Titans. On another note, Eren should take the socio-political history of both Eldia and Marley into account before making any decisions. The fact is he should use his powers to heal the world and not make a new regime all over again. 

      Also, it was never verified what happened to Fay. I have a feeling she is alive. 

      It is interesting the new season of anime has started. 

      In the end of the show I hope Eren is able to find closure and that he actually realises, as he did already, that Titans were not his enemy. Rather it was human greed that drove Titans. If the Great Titan War did not happen and if he the King did not remove himself to Paradis this would not have happened. 

      I wouldn't like the show to be a Us vs Them thing because it would be too silly. I would actually like good Marleyans and also horrible Eldians who know what's up but actually support Marley like I don't know King Reiss himself is one of them. I mean the royal family is responsible for all the problems in Paradis. They are okay with normal humans dying out as long as they can control Titans and Titan shifters. Think about it. When Wall Maria was breached they could have stopped the horde of Titans in Shinganshina District but did not and ultimately caused fatalities. More so than Marleyans they themselves were also responsible. This is the sort of crap that greed can accomplish. And, Eren should recognise this. 

      He should also show compassion for people like Annie and Reiner who had been blackmailed and subjugated all their lives to do Marley's biddings. They were never given an identity beyond this. If Eren fails to show comapssion and even understanding of people in this chaotic world he is working as badly as Eldian and Marley governments :/ That would be bad. 

      Yes, Marley's quest for imperialism should stop but not by making former mistakes. This cycle of hatred and death should be finally culled because it has taken so many lives and deformed so many people into Titans that clearly it is wrong. If you think about it the concept of Titan itself is a curse. Only Titan shifters can be said to have powers  but regular Titans lose everything and become nothing but oversized zombies. And Eldian rulers did use this practice to make cheap labour and also make armies but LITERALLY stripping away the humanity of their own people. This is also something that can't be ignored. There are some complicated plot points in AOT which is good but I hope the mangaka fleshes them out nor else this series will definitely fall flat on its face. 

      I seriously don't think anyone else but Ymir's people can turn into Titans but who knows maybe the serum will work on other races.

      Everyone wants peace lol but there are always different levels to that - Marleyan peace may be different from Eldian peace. And sorry to say this but Titans will never truly be extinguished it's impossible. Like I said earlier, Titan shifters don't have to be consumed in order for their abilities to be absorbed; it'll always find its way to another Eldian after their death through the unseen paths connecting them. A new lineage of Titans sounds reasonable but the 13 year expiry date is a bit scary because as soon as you become a Titan shifter you only have 13 years to live. Imagine being a newborn Eldian baby and dying at 13 for no reason it's so sad as you can't choose your fate. With Mikasa, I don't think it's a case of whether she cares or not but actually whether she is aware of the genocide that wiped out her race. Her parents may never have told her about that.

      But still man, Zeke was a disappointment like how could he do that. Ok yeah it was Grisha's fault but damn man, I don't think I'd sentence my dad to death just for forcefully trying to impose his ideologies on me. Even so there was no sense of loyalty with Zeke I mean no matter what that was his father and mother who got killed because of him. And he didn't even seem remorseful. I think Kruger says that Zeke got brainwashed by the Marleyans.

      I doubt Titans are evolving they are just doing what they have always been capable of - Titans can absorb powers by consuming other Titans. It was just proved by Grisha that any Titan can absorb another's power and add it to their own. The Progenitor Titan was eaten by Attack Titan Grisha and so the Attack Titan now has the Founder Titans power - the coordinate. Mikasa is already badass she doesn't need a Titan form she's the female Levi. Yes Eren should do the righteous thing but you know how he is, hot headed and emotional he probably bares hatred towards the Marleyans. At the end of chapter 90, Eren says that their enemies are beyond the wall and only true freedom will be accomplished if they kill them. So yeah Erens gonna go in guns blazing with no room for small talk.

      Yes it was, Grisha says in the manga that her body was found by a river after being severly bitten by dogs.

      You made me think for a second, I never thought like that. It is true the King could have saved lives by using the coordinate to drive away the Titans, but remember the Reiss family are under the Kings ideology and so believe in a world ruled by Titans so you can see why they didn't interfere.

      And yeah at first I bore nothing but hatred and anger at Reiner, Bertholdt and Annie. I couldn't understand why they would betray humanity like that but if you've read chapter 91 you'd understand. The Eldians that are in Marley have been brainwashed with false propaganda and I believe this is what happened to Zeke. They are brought up with false historical documents claiming that the Eldians in Paradis are spawns of the devil and need to be exterminated in order for the good Eldians who are in internment zones (basically ghettos like the underground district in Paradise) to be released from their poverty but it's obvious they are just being used to do their dirty work. It's so sickening to think that Eldians are killing themselves off. One half of the race against the other all because of the Marleyans.

      Absolutely, Marley are becoming too greedy way beyond control and it needs to stop. No one is perfect in this world but it seems things may have to go to choosing the lesser evil in the end. Think back to how many Survey Corps members died even civilians and innocents. Not only Eren, everyone from Paradis won't forget this and will surely wage war against Marley it seems inevitable.

      The Mid East Allied Forces may be troublesome in the future, the fact that they have developed weapons capable of taking down one of the 9 Titans in a single strike is frightening, they can't be trusted. This may really be what Hange said it was - Paradis vs the rest of the world. That would be an epic finale to the show but the world itself would be too damaged, what would the world look like in the end.

      We think the Founding Titan can't be destroyed but there might be a way. Maybe, something that we haven't thought of yet that is there. Even if the Titan shifting thing is born in a baby it still can be erased. After all there were once a time when humans were hust humans. 

      Yes, obviously, Paradis has to defend itself or rather some people of Paradis. But it shouldn't do what Marleyans are doing or what Eldians did so many years ago. Eren is hot tempered and emotional but he may eventually mature in the series as Ed Elric did in FMA. 

      I do believe Titans are evolving because from 9 now its 8. But yes the Royal family of Paradis are as bad as well Marleyan government now.

      The Mid East Allied forces are against Marley and The Edlian Restorationists did ask them for help once. So, they have weapons to destroy Titans there is nothing wrong with that. They also need to protect themselves because Titans can kill so many and devour so many. They should be allies because it would be kinda silly to fight everyone and just gain supremacy for Paradis again. That would be a stupid ass neo imperialism and it would do no one any favours. 

      I think I understand Zeke. Yes, what he did was wrong. But he was abused by Grisha and Dina. What his parents did was wrong. That poor guy was like only 5 or 7 and they kept on hounding at him to be a double agent. Do you know how wrong that is? Yes, he should not have turned his parents in and made that happen but his parents also should not have used him as a pawn. In fact, Grisha did it again with Eren. Yes, it helped Eren but at what cost? He has the curse of Ymir now too and he would never be able to live out his life outside that unless he detroys the coordinate in himself. That is pretty sad. 

      I do want Eren and Paradis to be one with the rest of the world. Even if Marleyan peace and Eldian peace is different there can be negotiations and both sides can shoulder their own burdens and each other. Making one epic finale battle will be nice to watch but also pretty much ruin the hell out of the world. People should coexist. lack of coexistence is one of the reasons even the real world is in so much problem.

      It would be great if the continents can live in harmony again and Eren and everyone gains peace. It would be actually awesome if Eren lives in Marley at the end of the series =) and tries to learn more about other countries and all that and works with Zeke. It would be nice. And actually great. 

      greedy ass marley would never let peace exist. and if the mass genocide really happened(on marley), then they would never forgive.... SPOILER: see season 2 ending , it shows what may have happened during the nine titan's rule

      Well, then now mass genocides on both side has happened there should peace. Destroying Marley won't make Eren and others look great or even help bring the satisfaction of their group. They already hated Paradis government for good reasons. Also Mikasa's people East Asia should be featured and I would actually like it if we have characters from there. 

        Loading editor
    • I wonder if the manga is even going to focus on the Mid East Allied Forces like with actual characters that would be great. Also Paradis working with them depends on how they meet. There's a very great chance that because of the war occurring it will be hard to distinguish between Marley and the Mid East.

      Humans are still Humans it's just the Eldians who are capable of transformation. Maybe the only way is to wipe out the whole Eldian race. Isayama did say he had an ending where everyone dies so that would be crazy lol. Edward Elric and Eren Yeager are in slightly different situations - Edward broke a taboo trying to bring his mother back which cost his brothers body as well as some of his limbs whereas Erens mother was eaten by a Titan because of the Marleyans. Edward feels a sense of guilt and remorse after what he did and tries to make up for it whereas Eren has no room for such feelings he is simply and purely full of hatred. It shows with every fight he has in Titan form, whenever he starts to win he starts to go overboard and a bit overkill. He gets controlled by his anger and starts mindlessly wrecking his opponents he almost killed Annie when they fought inside the walls. And he believes that all his problems will go away if he just kills all his enemies - that is one sad broken soul.

      The Titans went from 9 to 8 because one of them was eaten by another where does evolving come into it? I'm just putting it out there that the Mid East may pose a threat maybe they can be trusted but who knows but as long as Titans exists so will their weapons. They may bear hatred towards the Titans and so insecurity may still exist even if they join with Paradis. Lol maybe I'm just being paranoid haha. Yh it's true, the Marleyans are the enemy currently and they need to be defeated in order for everything to end, it wouldn't make sense for their still to be fighting afterwards. The Reiss family are truly as bad as the Marleyans but they can't be blamed for succumbing to the Kings ideology but even so now that I think about it when wall Maria was breached by the Colassal Titan Grisha went straight to where the Reiss Family were doing their ritual of passing down the Founder Titan power, maybe they might have done something about the breach but Grisha took that power away before we could have seen what the Reiss' would have done they probably wouldn't have done anything tbh due to the Kings ideology but we'll never know.

      Yeah I guess Zeke wasn't treated properly and even Grisha realised that he had been a bad father. Who else would Grisha have entrusted this power to? The reason why he did was because unlike anyone else Eren wanted to see the outside world, when Grisha noticed this that must have made up his mind. Grisha was probably going to explain things to Eren later but the attack by Marley on Paradis didn't leave him with time. Without that will to go beyond the wall Eren would not have been a good choice he would have ended up like Zeke.

      I can't wait till the next few chapters I mean in order to even use the coordinate Eren needs to be in contact with a member of the Reiss Family in Titan form I think I'm not sure. Do you think that Eren will have to eat Historia?

      Also it's kind of confusing to understand who can actually use the coordinate within the Royal bloodline, apparently the goddess Ymir's surname is Fritz so how is it that in Paradis the Fritz family are a stand in on the throne for the Reiss family I don't understand. Shouldn't the Fritz be the true rulers? Why are the Reiss considered to be the true Royal family, there doesn't seem to be any Reiss members in Marley only Fritz. Maybe they are just a branch family or something or the Frtiz married into the Reiss family or vice versa.

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    • Junior0124 wrote:
      I wonder if the manga is even going to focus on the Mid East Allied Forces like with actual characters that would be great. Also Paradis working with them depends on how they meet. There's a very great chance that because of the war occurring it will be hard to distinguish between Marley and the Mid East.

      Humans are still Humans it's just the Eldians who are capable of transformation. Maybe the only way is to wipe out the whole Eldian race. Isayama did say he had an ending where everyone dies so that would be crazy lol. Edward Elric and Eren Yeager are in slightly different situations - Edward broke a taboo trying to bring his mother back which cost his brothers body as well as some of his limbs whereas Erens mother was eaten by a Titan because of the Marleyans. Edward feels a sense of guilt and remorse after what he did and tries to make up for it whereas Eren has no room for such feelings he is simply and purely full of hatred. It shows with every fight he has in Titan form, whenever he starts to win he starts to go overboard and a bit overkill. He gets controlled by his anger and starts mindlessly wrecking his opponents he almost killed Annie when they fought inside the walls. And he believes that all his problems will go away if he just kills all his enemies - that is one sad broken soul.

      The Titans went from 9 to 8 because one of them was eaten by another where does evolving come into it? I'm just putting it out there that the Mid East may pose a threat maybe they can be trusted but who knows but as long as Titans exists so will their weapons. They may bear hatred towards the Titans and so insecurity may still exist even if they join with Paradis. Lol maybe I'm just being paranoid haha. Yh it's true, the Marleyans are the enemy currently and they need to be defeated in order for everything to end, it wouldn't make sense for their still to be fighting afterwards. The Reiss family are truly as bad as the Marleyans but they can't be blamed for succumbing to the Kings ideology but even so now that I think about it when wall Maria was breached by the Colassal Titan Grisha went straight to where the Reiss Family were doing their ritual of passing down the Founder Titan power, maybe they might have done something about the breach but Grisha took that power away before we could have seen what the Reiss' would have done they probably wouldn't have done anything tbh due to the Kings ideology but we'll never know.

      Yeah I guess Zeke wasn't treated properly and even Grisha realised that he had been a bad father. Who else would Grisha have entrusted this power to? The reason why he did was because unlike anyone else Eren wanted to see the outside world, when Grisha noticed this that must have made up his mind. Grisha was probably going to explain things to Eren later but the attack by Marley on Paradis didn't leave him with time. Without that will to go beyond the wall Eren would not have been a good choice he would have ended up like Zeke.

      I can't wait till the next few chapters I mean in order to even use the coordinate Eren needs to be in contact with a member of the Reiss Family in Titan form I think I'm not sure. Do you think that Eren will have to eat Historia?

      Yes, Ed and Eren are in different situations but I do think they have similar agendas in making things right or at least partly. Yeah, Eren wants to sometimes go die and kill off his enemies. That is why Mikasa is important in reminding him to live and all that. But, that is something he should also work by himself.  yeah, he is a traumatised soul. So was Ed. There are so many things Ed endured and had to endure. I think they have many comments traits too. I do say that Ed is more matured than Eren even from the beginning of the series. Eren is a bit rowdy and flawed to the extent he mostly cares about his wishes. 

      And well I don't think the Reiss family would have changed anything. They are as responsible as the Marelyans for hurting Paradis. Also, I do somewhat understand why Grisha killed them. They allowed a Titan rampage to happen as long as they could still stay in power. yes, I feel bad they were brainwashed. I also wished they weren't violently killed. But, there was no option. The way of Titans are a curse upto now. They must feed on each other to get each other's power. As I think Eren must have been completely shocked when he realised he ate his dad. I mean wow "cannibalism" in a way. 

      Mid East Allied forces may or may not trust Paradis people but they can be good allies. After all they wanna destroy Titans because Titans threaten almost all races. Titans eat people and indiscriminately cause mass murder. Obviously, people can be scared of Titans. But, this should have more to it than "oh, everyone is our enemy." because I think even some positive Marleyans would make the show better and also more realistic. 

      If Historia sacrifices herself for the sake of humanity - I can see her doing it. The unloved and dejected usually can muster courage to do these sorts of things. But, I hope Eren finds another way. It would be too cruel and unfair for Historia to come this far in life to actually to be eaten by Eren. Also, I don'[t think Eren would actually like to do this. It would be too painful for him. But seeing that the series is bloody it may ultimately come to that as well. 

      Now that Armin is a titan I wonder if he is eating his words "You have to be a monster to fight a monster and we become that we fight." Because what he said was only half-true. Eren did not kill Annie and in many cases he doesn't mind death. In fact he urged Historia to eat him to end his suffering. Yeah, it's nice Mikasa helps him that staying alive can be fruitful and that is why she is important to him. But, I think Eren should grow up a bit more. Mikasa should not have to always remind him to live. Eren should come to this by himself. 

      If new Titans emerge than it would be awesome. Also, I do wanna see what is the creature that Ymir Fritz made a contract with. I realise this is pretty interesting. That source of organic material is probably still around and it would be awesome if the endgame is fighting that thing.

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    • Grisha killed the Reiss family because of the Kings ideology. If the Reiss had been left in power Paradis would have been destroyed.

      And I just realised when u are a Titan there is no digestive tract. So after their fill they spit them out. So if ur a Titan shifter what happens to people you eat? I've never seen a Titan shifter upchuck a human hairball.

      Historia is beginning to be loved. She is the ruler of Paradis now. Eren says that he likes her true and honest self now. I really hope Eren does find another way. But Armin becoming a Titan was a shock to me, I wonder whether we'll see him in action. Eren is unlike most people he is truly honest and has pure feelings the fact that he urged Historia to eat him shows this - most people wouldn't care and would beg her not to eat them. Erin just feels a strong passion towards saving the world and if he feels that his sacrifice can accomplish that then he's willing to take the risk. Mikasa doesn't remind him to live, she selfishly wants him to stay alive for her sake, she doesn't want to lose him.

      New Titans? Hmm maybe who knows. Unless the Marleyans whip something up in a lab I doubt we'll see a new Titan.

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    • Junior0124 wrote:
      Grisha killed the Reiss family because of the Kings ideology. If the Reiss had been left in power Paradis would have been destroyed.

      And I just realised when u are a Titan there is no digestive tract. So after their fill they spit them out. So if ur a Titan shifter what happens to people you eat? I've never seen a Titan shifter upchuck a human hairball.

      Historia is beginning to be loved. She is the ruler of Paradis now. Eren says that he likes her true and honest self now. I really hope Eren does find another way. But Armin becoming a Titan was a shock to me, I wonder whether we'll see him in action. Eren is unlike most people he is truly honest and has pure feelings the fact that he urged Historia to eat him shows this - most people wouldn't care and would beg her not to eat them. Erin just feels a strong passion towards saving the world and if he feels that his sacrifice can accomplish that then he's willing to take the risk. Mikasa doesn't remind him to live, she selfishly wants him to stay alive for her sake, she doesn't want to lose him.

      New Titans? Hmm maybe who knows. Unless the Marleyans whip something up in a lab I doubt we'll see a new Titan.

      Yeah, that actually was a good twist. Armin becoming a titan. If Mikasa becomes one too or Jean or Sasha that would be awesome :D

      Just because Eren has honest feelings doesn't always make him likeable. I am sorry but Eren is a generic shounen hero in this respect because he gets angry and impassioned over things that are beyond him. Ed and some other shounen characters are not always like this. I will say the only shounen character I respected for thinking altruistically was Kenshin Himura and even then it did not always go idealtistically too much beyond him (not in the manga anyways).  Also Eren's purity is not always good. If you read Songs of Experience and Innocence you will notice Eren lacks the tiger spirit and is actually the "lamb" in that he is naive. In fact, his purity of intention is admirable but he should understand the world and himself better.

      Also, yup, good observation. I think Titan shifters either spit out humans or consume human characteristics as well? Like intel or memories? 

      New Titans would be fun though. Give the series a new direction. Eren wandering through East Asia is what I wanna see personally. 

      Btw, Junior. It is actually fun talking to you =) 

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    • Thanks :)), it's fun talking to you too Nephilim!

      What do u mean by Eren should understand the world and himself better. He just wants to save it doesn't he?

      Lol I thought all protagonists were likeable XD.

      Yh he is stubborn but it's fun to watch.

      And wow you actually might be right. I think Titan shifters do absorb memories that's how they have those visions and dreams.

      New Titans would be cool but it depends on who's side they are one.

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    • Junior0124 wrote:
      Thanks :)), it's fun talking to you too Nephilim!

      What do u mean by Eren should understand the world and himself better. He just wants to save it doesn't he?

      Lol I thought all protagonists were likeable XD.

      Yh he is stubborn but it's fun to watch.

      And wow you actually might be right. I think Titan shifters do absorb memories that's how they have those visions and dreams.

      New Titans would be cool but it depends on who's side they are one.

      New Titans don't have to be good to Paradis or Marley. That would make it better. 

      Not all protags are likeable. Protags are protags by popular vote which may not always be right. Shounen usually don't sport atypical heroes. Eren fit the hero bill so he is the main protag. If it was Levi who was the main character things would have been different and people may not have liked AOT as much though AOT would still make more sense or if not more ample sense. Including Mikasa because Mikasa has very neat dimensions and uncommon ones to be explored just because she is half-Asian but nope that may not sell well as shounen. As Seinen yes. 

      Also Eren started out a girl in the pilot manga who helped the main protag and was pretty much a scout who aspired to be like him and that is why you see those qualities in Eren that he aspires to be strong but is pretty naive and all of that. Eren wants to save the world but he doesn't get the world or how socio-politics works and how even Paradis is responsible for deaths and seculsion and exiling people. If Eren doesn't have this maturity it may make the series generic and that would be bad. 

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    • Killing Eren would never work if CommonSwifts theory of Titan "Infection" is correct. As we know, the eldians are obviously connected with paths. So, if Eren is killed, the power will simply move on to a baby of eldian blood. Also, mass protests would start outside isayama's house if he kills Eren.

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    • Arshpar wrote: Killing Eren would never work if CommonSwifts theory of Titan "Infection" is correct. As we know, the eldians are obviously connected with paths. So, if Eren is killed, the power will simply move on to a baby of eldian blood. Also, mass protests would start outside isayama's house if he kills Eren.

      That's what I've been saying and lol true Isayama would get hounded.

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    • NephilimGear wrote:

      Junior0124 wrote:
      Thanks :)), it's fun talking to you too Nephilim!

      What do u mean by Eren should understand the world and himself better. He just wants to save it doesn't he?

      Lol I thought all protagonists were likeable XD.

      Yh he is stubborn but it's fun to watch.

      And wow you actually might be right. I think Titan shifters do absorb memories that's how they have those visions and dreams.

      New Titans would be cool but it depends on who's side they are one.

      New Titans don't have to be good to Paradis or Marley. That would make it better. 

      Not all protags are likeable. Protags are protags by popular vote which may not always be right. Shounen usually don't sport atypical heroes. Eren fit the hero bill so he is the main protag. If it was Levi who was the main character things would have been different and people may not have liked AOT as much though AOT would still make more sense or if not more ample sense. Including Mikasa because Mikasa has very neat dimensions and uncommon ones to be explored just because she is half-Asian but nope that may not sell well as shounen. As Seinen yes. 

      Also Eren started out a girl in the pilot manga who helped the main protag and was pretty much a scout who aspired to be like him and that is why you see those qualities in Eren that he aspires to be strong but is pretty naive and all of that. Eren wants to save the world but he doesn't get the world or how socio-politics works and how even Paradis is responsible for deaths and seculsion and exiling people. If Eren doesn't have this maturity it may make the series generic and that would be bad. 

      Ok I understand now, Eren may not be able to think rationally and make good decisions based on actual events that have occurred. But now that he knows the truth behind the history of the world maybe he will mature more and become a better character I can definitely see that happening.

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    • BUT SRSLY, if hajime kills Eren, i'm gonna SUE HIM!

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    • Arshpar wrote: BUT SRSLY, if hajime kills Eren, i'm gonna SUE HIM!

      Your not the only one, that would be a mountain of debt that even 1700 years wouldn't be enough to pay it back XD!!

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    • Junior0124 wrote:

      NephilimGear wrote:

      Junior0124 wrote:
      Thanks :)), it's fun talking to you too Nephilim!

      What do u mean by Eren should understand the world and himself better. He just wants to save it doesn't he?

      Lol I thought all protagonists were likeable XD.

      Yh he is stubborn but it's fun to watch.

      And wow you actually might be right. I think Titan shifters do absorb memories that's how they have those visions and dreams.

      New Titans would be cool but it depends on who's side they are one.

      New Titans don't have to be good to Paradis or Marley. That would make it better. 

      Not all protags are likeable. Protags are protags by popular vote which may not always be right. Shounen usually don't sport atypical heroes. Eren fit the hero bill so he is the main protag. If it was Levi who was the main character things would have been different and people may not have liked AOT as much though AOT would still make more sense or if not more ample sense. Including Mikasa because Mikasa has very neat dimensions and uncommon ones to be explored just because she is half-Asian but nope that may not sell well as shounen. As Seinen yes. 

      Also Eren started out a girl in the pilot manga who helped the main protag and was pretty much a scout who aspired to be like him and that is why you see those qualities in Eren that he aspires to be strong but is pretty naive and all of that. Eren wants to save the world but he doesn't get the world or how socio-politics works and how even Paradis is responsible for deaths and seculsion and exiling people. If Eren doesn't have this maturity it may make the series generic and that would be bad. 

      Ok I understand now, Eren may not be able to think rationally and make good decisions based on actual events that have occurred. But now that he knows the truth behind the history of the world maybe he will mature more and become a better character I can definitely see that happening.

      Hopefully, =)

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    • If Ymir didn't eat Marcel does that mean 3 Titans would have invaded Shinganshina in the beginning?

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    • I have a doubt what if Eldian's story as the "evil" nation was all a lie from Marley? a nobleman mentioned something about "slave blood" if the war was just lost and Marley had managed to win the war why would they use such term?

      What if Eldian's were slaves of Marley all along, depricted to all other nations as Devils to ensure fear in them and brainwash Eldian's themselvers into submission out of guilt for sins that weren't their own?

      What if the first King had started to rebel and tried to give his people a bit of freedom in the Walls while ensuring the Coordinate couldn't be used anymore to break havoc.

      What if Marley wants the Coordinate to brainwash the Eldians into submission cause they are starting to get out of their control?

      Isn't it curious that the one titan that wasn't seized by Marley is descrived as the one that always moves forward seeking freedom?

      Also the thirteen year rule seems quite sketchy, except for Uri we haven't seen anyone get that old so fast could it be that it only applies to the coordinate but Marley made the other shifters believe it applyed to them too to ensure the Shifters couldn't rebel aganist them? it is easier to manipulate children over adults and by changing them often they are securing themselvers an obbedient puppet.

      You could argue that Kruger himself wasn't looking so good, but the previous holder might not have clarified that fact and he might have believed Marley's lie or he may have aged from stress.

      .

      It's fun to speculate :)

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    • CommonSwift wrote:
      I have a doubt what if Eldian's story as the "evil" nation was all a lie from Marley? a nobleman mentioned something about "slave blood" if the war was just lost and Marley had managed to win the war why would they use such term?

      What if Eldian's were slaves of Marley all along, depricted to all other nations as Devils to ensure fear in them and brainwash Eldian's themselvers into submission out of guilt for sins that weren't their own?

      What if the first King had started to rebel and tried to give his people a bit of freedom in the Walls while ensuring the Coordinate couldn't be used anymore to break havoc.

      What if Marley wants the Coordinate to brainwash the Eldians into submission cause they are starting to get out of their control?

      Isn't it curious that the one titan that wasn't seized by Marley is descrived as the one that always moves forward seeking freedom?

      Also the thirteen year rule seems quite sketchy, except for Uri we haven't seen anyone get that old so fast could it be that it only applies to the coordinate but Marley made the other shifters believe it applyed to them too to ensure the Shifters couldn't rebel aganist them? it is easier to manipulate children over adults and by changing them often they are securing themselvers an obbedient puppet.

      You could argue that Kruger himself wasn't looking so good, but the previous holder might not have clarified that fact and he might have believed Marley's lie or he may have aged from stress.

      .

      It's fun to speculate :)

      everyone would like that... and the way marley treat eldia and tell them about their past has always sounded phony, how could a person meet the devil, why would the 9 titan shifters go against marley and conduct a manslaughter when they have vast lands to inhabit around the world? why would the 145th king move to a puny island just to shift his capital city, how would he be so idiotic to leave marleyans alive if the eldians did conduct a manslaughter? and the biggest thing, why would 1700 years of this cleansing result in some puny humans(Marleyans) eventually getting the shifter powers? did the marleyans steal the power just like that? nope.

      just think, what chance would an army have against 8 titan shifters, even when the weaponry was limited? and IF ethnic cleansing was done 4 1700 years then there wouldnt be any marleyan left!

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    • There are actually other races than Marley and the royal family inside Paradis did exile the Asiatic people to death just becasue they refused royalty. So, I don't think it is a simple binary. There are Marleyans and obviously the Marleyan government is responsible for Eldian genocide but there is also an Eldian government who could have had such an effect many years ago. I am saying the common people of both Eldia and Marley may not be so evil or corrupted but power can corrupt those in power. In Full Metal Alchemist the mangaka showed this maturely on how there is evil within and pointing fingers at other people doesn't always get you forward. Yes, the attack Titan is the Titan who moves forward seeking freedom and there are different definitions to freedom. I want Marley to be defeated but not subjugated. I want the Eldian assholes also responsible for hurting their own people to be defeated. 

      Also, the history why only Eldians can turn into Titans is also a mystery. There has to be a reason why the flesh of Titans only come to Eldians and that in itself can be a dark history that threatens Eldians. I am pretty open minded. I don't want this show that delved into some philosphies to just curl up in itself and become a dichotomy of Good Vs Evil even Dragon Ball Z didn't go that route so it will be a shame if this manga and anime series goes this route. 

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    • Junior0124 wrote:
      If Ymir didn't eat Marcel does that mean 3 Titans would have invaded Shinganshina in the beginning?

      Always asking the important questions aren't ya ;) True, that is absolutely true! We would have had 3 Titan Shifters to deal with! Or the Eldians would. I guess Ymir did her people a favour doing what she did. Also, I hope Zeke understands that he shouldn't fight Paradis. The Marleyans use of Eldians in the Mid East Alliance was barbaric and I hope this makes them all realise that even if they don't support the royal family they should at least support the people of Paradis and form a unity with the world again. They should defeat the Marleyans but not to start a new conquest but to heal the world. But, it would be good to see good Marleyan characters too. I would like to see them helping Eren and fighting for Paradis. To make a dialogue and to heal the world everyone needs to be involved. 

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    • CommonSwift wrote:
      I have a doubt what if Eldian's story as the "evil" nation was all a lie from Marley? a nobleman mentioned something about "slave blood" if the war was just lost and Marley had managed to win the war why would they use such term?

      What if Eldian's were slaves of Marley all along, depricted to all other nations as Devils to ensure fear in them and brainwash Eldian's themselvers into submission out of guilt for sins that weren't their own?

      What if the first King had started to rebel and tried to give his people a bit of freedom in the Walls while ensuring the Coordinate couldn't be used anymore to break havoc.

      What if Marley wants the Coordinate to brainwash the Eldians into submission cause they are starting to get out of their control?

      Isn't it curious that the one titan that wasn't seized by Marley is descrived as the one that always moves forward seeking freedom?

      Also the thirteen year rule seems quite sketchy, except for Uri we haven't seen anyone get that old so fast could it be that it only applies to the coordinate but Marley made the other shifters believe it applyed to them too to ensure the Shifters couldn't rebel aganist them? it is easier to manipulate children over adults and by changing them often they are securing themselvers an obbedient puppet.

      You could argue that Kruger himself wasn't looking so good, but the previous holder might not have clarified that fact and he might have believed Marley's lie or he may have aged from stress.

      .

      It's fun to speculate :)

      The history of Eldia is that it was a small nation in Marley ruled world until Ymir became  a Titan. Then Eldians use the power of Titans to become a dominant nation. If you use Titans in warfare as we seen in Paradis it can only be a blood bath so Marley also grew resentful because their lands are now conquered by Eldians. Then Eldians started their genocides and rapes. It was not enough that they subjugated people and also took away their lands but they had to besmirch their identities. This is the same thing Marley is doing now so it is not a long shot that after Ymir some kings thought in this manner too. This prompted the Marleyans to steal Titans and start the war to gain back their decency. But Along the way obviously they too got corrupted with power so that is why they refer to Eldians as "slave blood" after all racism and discrimination can happen on both sides. Marley may resent the fact the power of Titans came to people who were once considered small and "lowly" just like Eldians later on felt they have Titan power so they should well keep on fighting wars and getting territories. There can be bad history on both sides. This does not excuse what Marley is doing now and that Eren should crush their giovernment and military. But this won't solve the fact there is a Titan serum and Zeke can turn people into Titans and that Titans are former people they need to be killed or if there is a serum to bring them back if it is possible. There are some complicated plot points in this story which is good. Eldians may not be innocent obviously but this not mean that Marley has carte blance and do whatever the f they want and subjugate Eldians. At the same time, Eren and others should remember the faults of Paradis in hurting other races and help Marleyans who want out of this bloody cycle. If there can be a dialogue they should have it. It is good to form multinational bonds and secure the world and heal it than just blow the crap out of everything. Also, the ethnic cleansing happened like 1,700 years ago. If there are Marleyans now more so than ever I mean they probably have reproducing for the last millenia. It doesn't mean their numbers weren't down once. And it doesn't excuse them from using Eldians in a bad way and treating Zeke and others as pawns. 

      The show is pointing a double edged sword. Who knows as Junior mentioned maybe Eren doesn't even think he is Eldian and just feels they are people of Paradis and not necessarily subjects of Ymir. Also, that can be true on the ground there are mixed blood in Paradis so that can actually mean other races can become well Titans - it can be possible. Who knows what if there are other Titans than the 9, now 8, of Ymir. That would be awesome and give another dimension to the show. Though the show started with a bang it;s becoming kinda slow and has not resolved much. I like the mystery but too much of it is becoming annoying that's all. 

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    • NephilimGear wrote: Also, the history why only Eldians can turn into Titans is also a mystery. There has to be a reason why the flesh of Titans only come to Eldians and that in itself can be a dark history that threatens Eldians. I am pretty open minded. I don't want this show that delved into some philosphies to just curl up in itself and become a dichotomy of Good Vs Evil even Dragon Ball Z didn't go that route so it will be a shame if this manga and anime series goes this route. 

      Ymir Fritz used her Titan Founder abilities to apparently bring prosperity to her people. After she died 13 years later her soul split into the 9 Titans who fought against Marley and established the nation of Eldia. Then the 1700 years of ethnic cleansing began and the Edlians believing that they were the superior race began to use other races to reproduce more Eldians. The establishment of Eldia brought about the monarchy which passed down the the founder Titan every 13 years to each generation. After doing a bit of research I have found out that the Titan War was actually fought between the other 8 Titan factions for supremacy in Eldia, not with Marley. Marleyans saw this as an opportunity to take advantage of the internal conflict and triggered a civil war, where they were miraculously able to capture 7 of the 8 Titans that were at war with each other. The 145th King abandoned his duties as the maintainer of Law and Order in an attempt to escape conflict and took some of the Eldian population behind the walls.

      Side note: So where had the Attack Titan been all this time, it was the only Titan that the Marleyans didn't capture and the King didn't take it behind the walls with him. It's interesting to think about how it was able to stay in Marley undetected.

      Only Eldians can turn into Titans because they are subjects of Ymir, they share her ancestral blood. If you don't have the blood of an Eldian in you, you can't turn into a Titan and you can't have your memories swiped.

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    • NephilimGear wrote:

      Junior0124 wrote:
      If Ymir didn't eat Marcel does that mean 3 Titans would have invaded Shinganshina in the beginning?

      Always asking the important questions aren't ya ;) True, that is absolutely true! We would have had 3 Titan Shifters to deal with! Or the Eldians would. I guess Ymir did her people a favour doing what she did. Also, I hope Zeke understands that he shouldn't fight Paradis. The Marleyans use of Eldians in the Mid East Alliance was barbaric and I hope this makes them all realise that even if they don't support the royal family they should at least support the people of Paradis and form a unity with the world again. They should defeat the Marleyans but not to start a new conquest but to heal the world. But, it would be good to see good Marleyan characters too. I would like to see them helping Eren and fighting for Paradis. To make a dialogue and to heal the world everyone needs to be involved. 

      Thanks :) (:

      Does Zeke not realise these are his people? To be honest I have conflicting views about Zeke. I don't know whether I should think of him as a potential ally or someone who needs to be put down. I'm not sure if it's the beast Titans ability to be able to turn eldians into Titans without the serum or it's the fact that he's got royal blood in him. But in chapter 92 they way they dropped Titans like bombs was disturbing and kinda cool at the same time. But Zeke doesn't even seem to show remorse - I wonder if his 13 years are almost up.

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    • Watching the 1st season of the anime again, it made me feel sick looking at Annie, Reiner and Bertholtd lol. I was just like you back-stabbing pieces of.... It's crazy how sympathetic they acted like they were on humanity's side when really they just being world class Hollywood actors.

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    • marley has officially taken it to a ZenoSama level by turning those many eldians into titans for nothing. I think we need Bishamonten or Yatogami in this situation

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    • Junior0124 wrote:

      NephilimGear wrote: Also, the history why only Eldians can turn into Titans is also a mystery. There has to be a reason why the flesh of Titans only come to Eldians and that in itself can be a dark history that threatens Eldians. I am pretty open minded. I don't want this show that delved into some philosphies to just curl up in itself and become a dichotomy of Good Vs Evil even Dragon Ball Z didn't go that route so it will be a shame if this manga and anime series goes this route. 

      Ymir Fritz used her Titan Founder abilities to apparently bring prosperity to her people. After she died 13 years later her soul split into the 9 Titans who fought against Marley and established the nation of Eldia. Then the 1700 years of ethnic cleansing began and the Edlians believing that they were the superior race began to use other races to reproduce more Eldians. The establishment of Eldia brought about the monarchy which passed down the the founder Titan every 13 years to each generation. After doing a bit of research I have found out that the Titan War was actually fought between the other 8 Titan factions for supremacy in Eldia, not with Marley. Marleyans saw this as an opportunity to take advantage of the internal conflict and triggered a civil war, where they were miraculously able to capture 7 of the 8 Titans that were at war with each other. The 145th King abandoned his duties as the maintainer of Law and Order in an attempt to escape conflict and took some of the Eldian population behind the walls.

      Side note: So where had the Attack Titan been all this time, it was the only Titan that the Marleyans didn't capture and the King didn't take it behind the walls with him. It's interesting to think about how it was able to stay in Marley undetected.

      Only Eldians can turn into Titans because they are subjects of Ymir, they share her ancestral blood. If you don't have the blood of an Eldian in you, you can't turn into a Titan and you can't have your memories swiped.

      not all Eldians can turn into titas.

      Only the subjects of ymir can, Eldia was a great empire with many citizens, all of them were eldians but not all of them were subjet of ymir. but they are probably the majority race of the eldians though.

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    • Junior0124 wrote:

      NephilimGear wrote: Also, the history why only Eldians can turn into Titans is also a mystery. There has to be a reason why the flesh of Titans only come to Eldians and that in itself can be a dark history that threatens Eldians. I am pretty open minded. I don't want this show that delved into some philosphies to just curl up in itself and become a dichotomy of Good Vs Evil even Dragon Ball Z didn't go that route so it will be a shame if this manga and anime series goes this route. 

      Ymir Fritz used her Titan Founder abilities to apparently bring prosperity to her people. After she died 13 years later her soul split into the 9 Titans who fought against Marley and established the nation of Eldia. Then the 1700 years of ethnic cleansing began and the Edlians believing that they were the superior race began to use other races to reproduce more Eldians. The establishment of Eldia brought about the monarchy which passed down the the founder Titan every 13 years to each generation. After doing a bit of research I have found out that the Titan War was actually fought between the other 8 Titan factions for supremacy in Eldia, not with Marley. Marleyans saw this as an opportunity to take advantage of the internal conflict and triggered a civil war, where they were miraculously able to capture 7 of the 8 Titans that were at war with each other. The 145th King abandoned his duties as the maintainer of Law and Order in an attempt to escape conflict and took some of the Eldian population behind the walls.

      Side note: So where had the Attack Titan been all this time, it was the only Titan that the Marleyans didn't capture and the King didn't take it behind the walls with him. It's interesting to think about how it was able to stay in Marley undetected.

      Only Eldians can turn into Titans because they are subjects of Ymir, they share her ancestral blood. If you don't have the blood of an Eldian in you, you can't turn into a Titan and you can't have your memories swiped.

      The Great Titan War started because the Tybur Family which is in possession of the War Hammer Titan decided to rebel again King Fritz and allied themselves with Marley capturing the 7 Titans. They also rule Marley from behind the shadows and give Marley the authority to do what they want to the Eldians to atone for the sins committed by the Eldians during the time of the Eldian Empire.

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    •  Well, I am not sure it completely didn't. Maybe, Ymir Fritz didn't do any damage but I am sure the nine titans did. They completely conquered Marley. No, seriously, was it just propaganda? because it is cited as something that did happen. And, no, I don't agree with Grisha Jaegar at all. Nor do I agree with Marleyan government mistreating Eldians. Nor do I agree with how Paradis treated its Asiatic citizens. They were persecuted and exiled. The socio-politics of Paradis are as bad as Marley. The Reiss family were okay if Eldians from Marley had hurt their citizens as long they can keep the coordinate. That is also oppression. 

      Whatever happened, it doesn't justify Marley's actions in any way. The Eldians of now should not be held responsible for the crimes of their ancestors. Just because they are descended from a supposedly evil race doesn't mean they are all inherently evil. And even then, not every Eldian necessarily took part. Besides, the Kings of Eldia could have simply FORCED their people to fight regardless of whether they wanted to or not. Whoever holds the Coordinate is essentially a God and He WILL be obeyed.  So what makes you disagree with Grisha Yeager? If it has to with his involvement with the Eldians Restorationists, I understand. They have an equally warped perspective of their ancestors, believing Ymir to be a benevolent figure who built the roads to peace and prosperity and gave them power (much like Prometheus). Of course, after Kruger set the record straight, you have to wonder: is Grisha wrong to want to have his people free? Is he wrong to wish vengeance upon those who took everything from him. Not at all. He is only human.

      I think I understand Zeke. Yes, what he did was wrong. But he was abused by Grisha and Dina. What his parents did was wrong. That poor guy was like only 5 or 7 and they kept on hounding at him to be a double agent. Do you know how wrong that is? Yes, he should not have turned his parents in and made that happen but his parents also should not have used him as a pawn. In fact, Grisha did it again with Eren. Yes, it helped Eren but at what cost? He has the curse of Ymir now too and he would never be able to live out his life outside that unless he detroys the coordinate in himself. That is pretty sad. 

      You are so wrong about what happened. Grisha may have mistreated Zeke, but that doesn't erase the fact that he still chose to join to the Marleyan War Program of his own accord. He is so horrifically opposed to Grisha's teachings that he is willing to believe everything that Marley taught him. And Grisha DID NOT do the same thing to Eren AT ALL. Unlike Zeke, he allowed Eren to develop his own beliefs about the world and... if not for the untimely attack from the Colossal Titan and the Armoured Titan in 845, he would have shown him the truth. Are so naive to believe that Grisha learned NOTHING from his mistakes? And do you really think he wanted Eren to go throough the same hell he experienced? Of course not. But he was out of time and no one else he could turn to. If he just died, then the Coordinate he stole from the royal family would be lost.

      I do want Eren and Paradis to be one with the rest of the world. Even if Marleyan peace and Eldian peace is different there can be negotiations and both sides can shoulder their own burdens and each other. Making one epic finale battle will be nice to watch but also pretty much ruin the hell out of the world. People should coexist. lack of coexistence is one of the reasons even the real world is in so much problem.

      That's not as simple as you think it is. The rest of the world hates the Eldians of Paradis and that is not going to change overnight. Also the Tybur Family is not looking for peace. They want to maintain the power that they have held for the past century. They don't care if it means eradicatin their own people. 

      It would be great if the continents can live in harmony again and Eren and everyone gains peace. It would be actually awesome if Eren lives in Marley at the end of the series =) and tries to learn more about other countries and all that and works with Zeke. It would be nice. And actually great. 

      If you want peace, prepare for war. There is no way this can be resolved without bloodshed. You might as well wish for the United States of America sign a pact with Korea and China to dismantle all their nuclear weapons. The only way humans can know peace is if there is someone with power to enforce that peace. We're just too simple-minded to negotiate. We hate without reason. We kill without reason. Marley will never be a good place to live in as long as the Tybur Family controls it. They have to die as do the members of the Government who spread the lies of the Eldian people being filthy demons. 

      That's the saddest part. Even the Eldians living with Marley genuinely believe that the people of Paradis are all evil incarnate. Their OWN people. They just blame them for all of their misgivings, either out of fear, or blind devotion to Marley. Reiner's mother for example is truly despicable, seeing as how lied to Reiner and manipulated him all for her own sake. Now she's doing the same to Gabi.

      My point to all this is that your delusions of peace and harmony for everyone are just that... delusions. This can't end with everyone happy. It never does. Someone will have to suffer. Someone will pay the price. And even then, the war may not end...

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    • "If you want peace, prepare for war. There is no way this can be resolved without bloodshed."

      They should try to lessen the bloodshed than exacerbate it. In my thoughts I didn't say Marley is justified with what they are doing nor did I say that Eldian descendents should face the brunt of what their ancestors did. Also, I don't want real world analogies always being made seeing it is not entirely the same thing or even remotely the same. Additionally, I don't appreciate being called "naive" just because I had some different views. Is Zeke justified in his actions? No. Not really. He was pushed to them and he did show complete shock at Eldians being used as war fodder. I am not wrong about what happened. I said the Eldians are not innocent either. Did I say sure let Marley kill them then? No. I rather hate what the Marleyans are doing. I also hated Grisha thinking the Eldians are superior. My thoughts were that the Eldians on Paradis must learn from this and try to harmonise the world if possible. 

      Also some people hate Attack on Titan now. They think that the mangaka is making one side look like Japan and the other Korea and completely condoning Japan's actions towards Korea. Which is like really unfair if the mangaka is drawing on that. 

      "My point to all this is that your delusions of peace and harmony for everyone are just that... delusions. This can't end with everyone happy. It never does. Someone will have to suffer. Someone will pay the price. And even then, the war may not end..."

      You know something. Saying this to me is exceptionally rude and pretty immature. Wanting to make the option of less casualties is something the real world at times strives, even as a front to do. You can disagree with me but saying my opinions are delusional makes me realise either you don't like people who don't have the same world views as you. Or, you aren't grown up much and so want to make basic discussions antagonistic. 

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    • NephilimGear wrote:
      "If you want peace, prepare for war. There is no way this can be resolved without bloodshed."

      They should try to lessen the bloodshed than exacerbate it. In my thoughts I didn't say Marley is justified with what they are doing nor did I say that Eldian descendents should face the brunt of what their ancestors did. Also, I don't want real world analogies always being made seeing it is not entirely the same thing or even remotely the same. Additionally, I don't appreciate being called "naive" just because I had some different views. Is Zeke justified in his actions? No. Not really. He was pushed to them and he did show complete shock at Eldians being used as war fodder. I am not wrong about what happened. I said the Eldians are not innocent either. Did I say sure let Marley kill them then? No. I rather hate what the Marleyans are doing. I also hated Grisha thinking the Eldians are superior. My thoughts were that the Eldians on Paradis must learn from this and try to harmonise the world if possible. 

      Also some people hate Attack on Titan now. They think that the mangaka is making one side look like Japan and the other Korea and completely condoning Japan's actions towards Korea. Which is like really unfair if the mangaka is drawing on that. 

      "My point to all this is that your delusions of peace and harmony for everyone are just that... delusions. This can't end with everyone happy. It never does. Someone will have to suffer. Someone will pay the price. And even then, the war may not end..."

      You know something. Saying this to me is exceptionally rude and pretty immature. Wanting to make the option of less casualties is something the real world at times strives, even as a front to do. You can disagree with me but saying my opinions are delusional makes me realise either you don't like people who don't have the same world views as you. Or, you aren't grown up much and so want to make basic discussions antagonistic. 

      Nicely written. Sure, many ppl hate SnK. but the twists are what will attract them back every month.... Eren is the antagonist now, and Reiner the protagonist, which I definitely did not expect. Eren is the villain we all will hate. But that means that we are very very mixed into the story. Eren is in reality doing nothing wrong. How? He clearly had the aim of killing only Tybur and maybe the Marleyan officials. He didn't want to kill any Eldian. The Eldians that may have been killed by his sudden burst, were just losses of war. In whatever way we consider, Eren is still that little kid who lost his mother in some way..

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    • They should try to lessen the bloodshed than exacerbate it. In my thoughts I didn't say Marley is justified with what they are doing nor did I say that Eldian descendents should face the brunt of what their ancestors did. Also, I don't want real world analogies always being made seeing it is not entirely the same thing or even remotely the same. Additionally, I don't appreciate being called "naive" just because I had some different views. Is Zeke justified in his actions? No. Not really. He was pushed to them and he did show complete shock at Eldians being used as war fodder. I am not wrong about what happened. I said the Eldians are not innocent either. Did I say sure let Marley kill them then? No. I rather hate what the Marleyans are doing. I also hated Grisha thinking the Eldians are superior. My thoughts were that the Eldians on Paradis must learn from this and try to harmonise the world if possible. 

      Yeah now you're just repeating yourself. I may have exaggerated what I said about you being wrong, but I do think you're wrong about Grisha. He made many mistakes but he did not repeat history with Eren. And as for "harmonising the world", I'm sorry but if you think this has a happy ending you really haven't been paying attention. Alternatively, if you're just saying this is what they SHOULD do, not what they WILL do, you're right. They probably should. But realistically speaking (realistic being used in a loose sense here) there is no way that is going to happen.



      Also some people hate Attack on Titan now. They think that the mangaka is making one side look like Japan and the other Korea and completely condoning Japan's actions towards Korea. Which is like really unfair if the mangaka is drawing on that. 

      Okay, I did not realize that. All I see is a slight reversal of positions between the Eldians and the Marleyans dating all the way back to chapter one. But the difference here is that the focus is not wiping out every civilian (except in Floch's case) but killing the greatest threats to their existence. We must remember what Eren said back in Episode 4: "We didn't start this fight... but we will finish it." Even if they have became the demons that everyone claims them to be... I still see them as nominal heroes. I definitely disapprove of bomving civilian buildings but not people like Jean and Sasha clearly maintain some morals.

      "My point to all this is that your delusions of peace and harmony for everyone are just that... delusions. This can't end with everyone happy. It never does. Someone will have to suffer. Someone will pay the price. And even then, the war may not end..."

      You know something. Saying this to me is exceptionally rude and pretty immature. Wanting to make the option of less casualties is something the real world at times strives, even as a front to do. You can disagree with me but saying my opinions are delusional makes me realise either you don't like people who don't have the same world views as you. Or, you aren't grown up much and so want to make basic discussions antagonistic. 

      That's your opinion. Of course you may not realize this, but it comes across as hypocritical and self-righteous. You act like I'm immature because I point out the obvious flaw in your desires. You don't like it, then don't read it. Though I do realize to call your opinions "delusions" may be a tad too much. Just saying that it really is not reasonable to believe that we can have peace right now. Also, making statements about my age, and trying to hold the high moral ground make you out to be rather obnoxious.



      Sorry, if I offended you but at the same time, you should grow up.

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